Taxis - Black Cabs, Uber, Illegal Cabbies

I have in the past, but not often and I stopped entirely last year. When I need a taxi I accept the costs of getting a black cab. I don't buy from Amazon either. I try and select goods and services that aren't based on gross forms of exploitation, but it is hard to avoid in our society.

I also lol'd

In the licensing authority that I work for (names to be changed to protect the indolent) drivers predominantly BME across both private hire and hackney (actually the same thing for us). Without doing a full count, I don't think I'd be out of line saying that it's upward of 70% combined Asian.

There's a lot of context in this though if you look at taxi/private hire driving as work opportunities among post war immigrant populations.

all Uber advocates in this thread

haven't seen any of those around.

Just to be clear, instead of prius(es?) we will now have diesel powered black cabs? The drivers of which are actively anti-cycling?

A fair digital economy is possible and I was looking forward to dance on the grave of LTDA.

I work in the gig economy and zero hours but for a workers co op. Am very happy with the arrangement.

Anyone seen the email from Uber asking to sign their petition?

A fair digital economy is possible and I was looking forward to dance
on the grave of LTDA.

Patience. The promised land is a-coming.

If you actually caught Ubers and talked to the drivers I don't think you'd compare the system to zero hours contracts (and I don't think they'd agree that it is a gross form of exploitation either).

Strange, the tribunal courts found that it is exactly the case. It doesn't matter what uber or the drivers thinks when it's shown with evidence in court that they are not self-employed.

Anyone seen the email from Uber asking to sign their petition?

Everyone who has used Uber in London will probably be getting one. 152,220 people have signed the petition already.

I haven't signed it. I'd need to see Uber committing to pay the appropriate levels of corporation tax first (amongst other things).

Not only will this decision deprive you of the choice of a convenient way of getting about town, it will also put more than 40,000 licensed drivers who rely on our app out of work.

So it was work then !

I'm not talking about whether they're self-employed or not, I'm talking about making value judgements without actually asking the people apparently being 'grossly exploited' if it works for them.

I haven't used them due to their nefarious tax arrangements, but there's plenty else to dislike. Obvs we need clean vehicles - black cabs are not they - but I'm also for discouraging cheap non-public transport.

I would love to see new regulation regarding emissions of black cabs. Can just imagine the uproar if they were forced to go electric.

Yes, I don't doubt that many feel like that. Having a job with regular income, and having some degree of choice over your hours, is likely to be viewed positively.

But drivers could probably do better. What do you think they would say if you were to offer them a contract, some benefits (e.g. annual leave and sick pay), and also have employer NI (and tax) payments made on their behalf, etc.

Uber isn't offering them that. For that to happen Uber would need to acknowledge their responsibilities as employers, and increase their (artificially supressed) prices to cover the additional costs.

Drivers should be able to choose to a job with those kinds of benefits, but by the time Uber has forced most of the competition out of business, those types of roles probably won't exist anymore.

Regulations (and the like) get a bad press, and while some are frustrating, and they usually result in extra costs for businesses, they are nonetheless often aimed at protecting the most vulnerable in society. That's probably why the Tories are rubbing their hands with glee at the potential of the post-Brexit 'bonfire of regulations'!

increase their (artificially supressed) prices

Excuse my ignorance, could you explain what you mean by this?

Do many other mincab/taxi firms offer employment rather than self-employed though? I know AddLee are all self-employed for instance (and you have to hire your car from Add Lee)

This kind of thing
https://www.fastcompany.com/4026256/investors-are-paying-2-billion-per-year-to-subsidize-your-uber-ride

(There will doubtless be lots more articles that dig deeper into the numbers e.g. this one)

From 2018
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/business/2017/jul/11/black-cab-turns-green-new-electric-london-taxi-levc-tx

Prices are surpressed because Uber wants to be able to corner a market share through price. At the moment the company as a whole is literally billions in the hole as far as operating costs are concerned.

At a point, market share will stabilise, development will tail off and it will increase its prices and margins accordingly and be able to recoup its initial losses with a minimal decline in drivership. Occasionally it will indulge in price surges because it knows that the revenues that it will generate at those times won't have an impact on it's core customer base but that is by no means enough to cover much of the losses.

Excuse my ignorance but where does it say that from 2018 only electric black cabs are allowed and the diesel ones will have to be scrapped?

At a point, market share will stabilise, development will tail off and it will increase its prices and margins accordingly and be able to recoup its initial losses with a minimal decline in drivership.

Or investors may decide that prices cannot ever be increased enough to recoup or stem losses, without losing market share, and the company would disappear overnight.

Possibly. But if they're tapped into the global business (profits) you could imagine that there will always be more relaxed markets where Uber can keep all their costs to an absolute minimum so as to more or less guarantee a return for the more clued-up investors (as opposed to the muppet investors who get fleeced with a bad deal).

Zero hour contracts are fine it's how they are sometimes abused