EU referendum, brexit and the aftermath

Debate, eh?

My first is that there cannot possibly be any other option once NI leave the EU than to have a hard border with the Republic. This is fucked and sets the whole Island back 20-30 years.

Counter or provide a benefit that out weighs that cluster-fuck.

And I welcome that, as it means you support parliamentary democracy.

There are many general trends for Brexit, but the right-wing media and Exit Polls have already been discussed. Not so much personal views, only one person came on board here saying why.

I have quite a few lefties on my Facebook, and my first gut reaction is "The Tories are in power, did you not see the Leave campaign leaflets, did you not expect this????" but they will not bend on some of their principles and hope the UK will now be better than the UK, a hope I don't share.

So far even polite questions have been extremely fruitless on Facebook. A few people are willing to acknowledge issues, but most of the time it's not even a "agree to disagree" but a repeat of things we have now come to realise have been lies or promises that could not have been met.

What genuinely baffles me is that people didn't expect this as a ginormous shitstorm, Tories in power, no alternative to the EU, trade agreements taking at least 10 years, being in a weak position... Hence my question.

I don't see a 10 year good vision either BTW. More a sucking up to the USA and NI sliding backwards...of course I understand sometimes you need to pay a price.

TL:DR I am frustrated as hell and genuine don't get it AND I think we are all going to get screwed and problems leading to brexit won't get resolved. But maybe you genuinely didn't think I was going to end like that, as the campaign promises are broken already. Not even talking about the NHS bus, but not leaving the EEC for example... We didn't know we were going to get May etc etc. Or have a positive vision.

I really am not looking for a fight, my comment was merely in support of Gina Miller and hers and others standing up to the outcome.

Well I voted against Brexit and I agree with you...

For the record Gina Miller is very keen to stress that her court case was about Parliament being consulted, which she felt strongly about, not about her trying to stymie Brexit.

It's almost impossible to say whether that's true or not, but that's what she says.

I do think whether you agree with her or not she's handled herself pretty well, rising above a lot of personal attacks by constantly pointing out that it's not about her or her background but her right as a citizen to bring the case.