EU referendum, brexit and the aftermath

1 and 2 in another 20-40 years (just like here)

3...hm...now that IS a big issue! I believe ROI has problems with people leaving too...no jobs.

But surely then a solution for the apathy must be found? :)

Anecdotally, in my last job we had young-ish people who would literally turn up on the doorstep begging for work, CVs in hand.

An old friend of mine moved to Ireland a few years back, she was living in the Republic but working just over the border in NI... I imagine she might find herself in a bit of a tricky position if all this guess through...

BTW #WTAFIGO

I've done research around this to satisfy myself I wasn't talking bollocks or my or my peers experiences were bucking a national trend.

Fuck it's sad, yes the papers show that respective governments have tried hard to engage with NEETS, harder than anything I experienced growing up.

What can't be denied is that the affect of my generations poverty is having a snowball affect.
Kids of 1970's kids who grew up in poverty as teenagers have a QUADRUPLED chance of still being in poverty by the time they're 42 which is predicted to continue until someone can find a successful way to stop this viscous circle.
Given the doom and gloom predictions of the affect on the young of a Brexit is sad, really sad.

This is exactly what the Francis report was and it was shocking.

Looks like we're going to have to employ some immigrants to help us out:

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Hilarious

I know it's going back pages to your comment about manufacturing but I've been busy.

I didn't suggest that we should be trying to compete with the cheapest manufacturers, I would like to see us producing goods like Miele/Festool/Fein. Brands that represent quality of manufacture with a no compromise price, in the same way that Clifton/Sorby etc represent some of the highest uncompromising quality in woodworking tools or Rolls Royce represents incredible engineering.

Our aerospace industry is one of the biggest in the world. Cutting edge manufacturing that applies to F1 and space is coming from some areas of the country. We have an amazing engineering culture which we could make more of.

I'm a tradesman and have been for 25 years, I do understand the argument you're making about young people/apprentices. I don't believe the answer is to increase the financial services casino which recently cost us all so much money to prop up, it currently hovers around 80% of gdp and doesn't need encouraging. What we have to hope is that people will maintain an interest in producing innovative products that can attract staff to work for/with them.

On the question of credit getting out of hand, that cycle began post-war as an effort to kick-start manufacturing. It's now kick started manufacturing around the world but not here.

I agree in principle, but I recently had to buy some new power tools for a large project. I'm used to using the 'best' and never purchased anything except Festo when I was a tradesman. I was convinced by the sales guy I used to deal with that I didn't need to buy Festo as the cheaper brands had caught up quality wise.

So my worry is that we are too far behind, and now due to the massive investment and progress China and India has made in their R&D sectors and they can churn out high quality items far cheaper than we can.

I suspect we're both talking about the same area here. East Lancs?

I think the trouble with the technical colleges is that they're trying to recruit at age 14. At that age it's difficult to get kids to move school, move focus, etc.

I wrote to my MP expressing my concern/displeasure at the outcome of the referendum. Wasn't really expecting a reply but today I received the following email from him.

As you are one of the very many people who have recently contacted me regarding the EU Referendum, I am writing to you to confirm my views on this extremely important issue.

I don’t know whether at the time last year that the European Union Referendum Act was passed that anybody seriously foresaw the cascade of events that would follow the campaign and the majority for the Leave side of the argument. Since the result I have been inundated, mostly by e-mail, with messages arising from the result, indeed I’ve had more contacts on this subject than any other during my time in Parliament. Nearly all have been opposed to “Brexit”.

It is still difficult to know how events will unfold but during the Statement in the House on Monday 27th June, I made my position clear to the Prime Minister as follows “Some discussion following the statement has revolved around the response of Members of this House to the decision of last week. Throughout my experience during 24 years in this House, I have regarded my primary responsibility as being to the people of Lewisham West and Penge, who voted 2:1 for remaining in the European Union. Thus, I will oppose any measures that come before this House that would seek to undermine that.” It is vital to protect jobs, secure growth, encourage investment and ensure our security and influence in the world and I do not believe that this can be best achieved by withdrawing from the EU.

Thanks again for contacting me on this important issue.

Best Wishes

Jim Dowd

Jim Dowd MP
Lewisham West and Penge

Spot on, perhaps you're right. It's a shame the local community is to lose projects like this.

All valid points and socially mobile doesn't just mean 'rags to riches'. It can also mean unemployed sofa surfing to having a secure job with a secure home.

I couldn't agree about the Festool kit not having an edge over most of the competition. Maffell however have had a few advantages in quality and operation over Festool for a while.

It's still a question of some customers being prepared to stick with a high quality product at a higher price for the minimal gains (i.e. System compatibility in Festool's case). There is no need to compromise manufacturing quality to compete in a crowded low price market and the Chinese will always have logistics adding cost and customer support is more difficult.

We are not behind any country in terms of our research and development. Our manufacturing industry and universities are at the bleeding edge of technology but the population has abandoned it as a profession.

As you say it's a question of perception, a lot people couldn't feel proud to work in industry or skilled labour, it's seen as a fallback from any easier way to make a good living. I could go on but I'm not that bothered whether people go to work to enrich this country or not. I have my own way of getting by and there will be demand for my skills all the time people are living in houses, come the zombie apocalypse I will have loads of plywood for the windows and be very handy with an axe!

In Belfast Harland and Wolff declined badly, now that they got new contracts in they couldn't fill all jobs with locals.

Bombardier: Lots of people on swinging door contracts. It's just not attractive in some areas to work in manufacturing :/ Is this a UK wide issue, or just bad over here?

(says the person who wouldn't mind learning welding / brazing / making stuff etc. fecking computers)

Has this been article 50'd yet?

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/07/04/legal_challenge_eu_article_50/ no no we are going to court it seems.

;)

Was the sort of answer I was hoping for, but agree that it would certainly be harder for an MP wished to remain but whose constituents voted to leave. I suppose it's down to whether they feel their career is more important than their own view on what is best for the country as a whole.

I agree in principle, but I recently ....

It's puzzling you conclude abandoning r&d is the answer.

Just one issue with putting all our eggs in the City of London basket is we'll end up even more of a tax haven - cue desparate disparities in wealth and (more importantly) quality of life.

That's one way of looking at it.

The other is that the Article 50 could potentially be triggered by using the Royal Prerogative - meaning the timing would be chosen by a PM that hasn't been elected by the population without any consultation with Parliament.

As such Mishcon de Reya's instruction is acting early to ensure the government acts legally and constitutionally.

Hmmm, I don't remember saying abandon R&D. As I understand it from the news, isn't quite a lot of the funding for R&D (I include sciences in this) coming from EU partnerships? And what will happen to this funding if we do end up leaving the single market. Which seems likely to happen as that's an under pinning principle of the EU and EEC, and quite clearly the Brexit vote seems to have been won on the premis of shutting down our borders.
I really hope that Germany still wants our engineering exports once this debacle settles down - according to the government's figures they're our largest engineering customer.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/credit-suisse-ceo-tidjane-thiam-blames-brexit-on-britains-lack-of-investment-in-education_uk_577a764ee4b073366f0f7684

Also asked for his bonus to be cut.
(it's good I was sitting down...)

So I read there's areas where pupils get one meal a day? I mean, there's no need for that is there...? O_o
[fareshare is an excellent food bank type charity btw if that sort of thing bothers you]

what stats don't show is the apathy people have towards wanting to be socially mobile.

So rising inequality is because people are feckless and lazy. I see.

[Edit] I've chimed in late and the conversation appears to have moved on.

Anecdotally, yes.