In the news

Yeah, maybe they don't like those cartoons

And not very good.

You realise there are plenty of non Muslim countries with freedom of speech issues... And plenty of Muslim countries who aren't locking up random people all the time... Almost as if freedom of speech isn't inherently connected to which sky wizard your country aligns?

Yeah, but he didn't say that it was inherently connected. You're putting words in his mouth a little there.

republish the cartoons that caused people to get killed

I instagramed the front page of the original publication earlier. Yes the cartoon is offensive to some people obviously as we know because of the tragedy in front of us.

We all have our own ideals and there is always going to be a view that we disagree with. I come out with plenty of stupid shit all of the time but I would rather defend someone's right to express a view that I disagree with and vice versa, than live in a world where we are too afraid to speak freely for fear of death.

I'm looking at images of people gathering in the Paris city centre, I can only imagine the atmosphere there right now. It's moving to see this kind of solidarity.

I'm not sure I am, he's using "radical Muslims" to excuse sloppy use of Muslim earlier, but Muslim is nothing to do with it. It's radicals, of all or no faith who are the problem.

/thread

Is it wrong to want Mensch to post a Charlie Hebdo image and have a fatwa declared against her? Sending her to the states obviously hasn't fucking worked, maybe the Iranians or Syrians can shut her up or at least turn the volume down a bit. That and Katie fuckin looks like a horse with heatstroke wossername. And maybe Jeremy Vine, he gets right on my tits too. #muslamicrays

And re: link to some twat's blog saying Charlie Hebdo was a racist publication by and for white men. No. Fucking. Clue. It's like comparing the Daily Show to Mein Kampf, and only fucking humorless ignorant fetidspunkdepositories would so hugely miss the point.

Yes. Louise Mensch is a stupid and deeply annoying self-publicist with no discernible utility or talent. However, she is easily ignored. And she did once provide useful cannon-fodder for Ian Hislop on HIGNFY.

The cartoons are pretty shit though.

Didn't she try to make the point that people protesting against unfettered banking somehow diluted their message by buying coffee from Starbucks?

Yeah, I had a rummage around and have yet to find a Hebdo cartoon that I found funny. They're a bit crap as far as satire go.
But in any case, would I dare to cycle trough London with one of them printed on the back of a t-shirt? I wouldn't, and as such I'm not so sure that the pen really is winning.

Meh, some are funny, some aren't. You have to understand the French mentality and their delight in the more cerebral aspects of culture, I saw an interview with the ex-editor today and amidst crying for his friends he was imploring the right to free expression as any good Frenchman with a romantic idealism that clashes with a deep intellectual cynicism about politics would.

Whether you think they were funny or no they were some of the bravest and most principled advocates for free speech in Europe, and all the 'they had it coming' chat from folk is pretty ill informed in light of what they actually stood for. And fucking Anjem Choudary... what a nasty cunt.

People thinking this is about the cartoons, wow.

Yeah, but in this case (and the ones he listed) it happens to be muslims. He didn't draw any conclusions other than that "freedom of speech is not an option with a large proportion of the muslim world", which sadly is true, even though its not unique.

Anyway, laying the blame on generic 'radicals' is like laying the blame on poltergeists or the alignment of the stars. You may as well just say 'bad people will be bad people regardless', which is true, but in these cases, they happen to also be muslim, and their motivations to that end have an awful lot to do with it. Whether they are politically radicalised or they're just mental or both, they chose Islam as the flag to wave over this atrocity.

IMO, making a distinction between these cunts and peaceful modern religious people is very important, and the way to do that is to address their misconceived motives as muslims, and their abuse of Islam or whatever, and completely discredit them. Passing the buck or considering them a random anomaly gets us no closer to addressing whatever caused this or allowed this to happen in the first place, because no-one feels responsible.

Playing devils advocate here a bit and i've had a couple beers btw.

arguin about terrism on a biek forum while pissedup, 's wot the interwebz woz made 4.

i thought the cartoons were quite offensive in the depiction of muslims and jews of what i saw i.e. much like how the nazis drew jews and gypsies ,this was regarded as racist ever since , however the cartoons should have been published .
bbc policy is not to show them according to david dimbleby on question time tonight . there was a fleeting glance of charlie hebdo covers on the news , so where is our freedom of speech ? is islamic terrorism is getting the upper hand ?

theres no doubt the young killers were radicalised in the same way as our own woolwich barracks killers , this sets them out from other muslims but they are radicalised by cunts like anjim choudary who has 23,000 followers on twitter so does that potentially make a 5th column "army"at war as ayaan hirsi ali said on newsnight last night .

i believe a dutch journalist was arrested on terrorism charges in turkey !

It doesn't happen to be Muslims, he selected cases of Muslims.

from :
https://twitter.com/anjemchoudary
http://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2015/01/07/islam-allah-muslims-shariah-anjem-choudary-editorials-debates/21417461/
"Therefore, Muslims do not believe in the concept of freedom"

I wouldn't, and as such I'm not so sure that the pen really is winning.

Le Pen will come out of this on top.

#mindbleach

Khornight2 :i selected cases with references to the subject of killing for blasphemy (within the current subject discussion which is islamic terrorism ) .

bbc showing live coverage of the manhunt north of paris
beautiful countryside round that part of france i must say
lots of pictures of the inside of a peugeot 106 ... sweet