Coffee Appreciation

don't even get me started on the muffins, sistah!

The muffin man has just given his verdict. Nothing else counts.

Unrelated:

http://www.theonion.com/articles/man-not-himself-until-he-has-so-much-coffee-he-fee,36933/?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm_campaign=LinkPreview:1:Default&recirc=gods

Great respone bid_daddy_wayne.

What I meant by scientific approach is more a method for getting to nice coffee, not that there is one prevailing theory of good coffee. It's all about testing and continuing learning. I think a lot of people in the coffee industry have no idea how to do this.

I'll cool it and you're probably right, im just sick of putting in effort to be shot down by someone who orders an espresso/filter has says it doesn't taste like real coffee.

I'd really like if nice little communities like this forum could support quality and appreciation of progress, instead of being all "I just think it tastes better with 19g"

Sure there is subjective elements, but it's pretty well agreed that good coffee tastes better for known reasons, and you can't just say "I like over extracted coffee". If someone really only likes over extracted coffee, I'd argue there is probably less people who agree with this person then the likes of the people who run COE, or specialty coffee places.

It's kind of like how good wine is good, and if you subjectively don't like it, you're not really included in drinking it, and you shouldnt argue that you know which wine is better.

If I continue to post in here, I'll take it a lot easier as apparently people get offended pretty easily. Also, I'm fully 100% open to be proven wrong, but try your best and give strong evidence, so we can continue the scientific approach and appreciation of nice things.

W/e dudes. I hate saying "good enough" with anything I do in life. Including coffee, bikes etc.

And I think English sarcasm goes over my head

I really fancy a cup of maths right now

Get back to the scotch eggs m8

English sarcasm goes over my head

Welcome to LFGSS.
You will feel entirely at home here!

try your best and give strong evidence, so we can continue the scientific approach

There are a lot of enthusiasts in here, but I'm pretty sure not that much people sharing your determined "scientific" approach - maybe in some "real" coffee geek forum you'd find more people that share your view?

Welcome to lfgss. IMO everything you've said checks out, the methodology you recommend is by far the easiest way to produce a consistently good result at home. Starting with an attack on other peoples opinion may not have been the best way to settle in though!

Firstly it would be nice to recognise a difference between dark roast and over roasted. I'm fortunate enough to live in Amsterdam, a city where the specialty coffee scene is still building up so we see a new roaster pop up every few months. Most of these are doing a fairly standard Scandinavian approach. However there are a few that have made a considered decision to roast a bit darker and aim for a different profile. Obviously not starbucks dark, but enough to make a marked difference in flavour, and one that I personally find benefits espresso (though not filter). Most of the roasters are friendly with each other so its not too uncommon to hear that another place is using the same beans, allowing a chance to make a direct comparison between different roasting styles. Interestingly it was those that roast a bit darker who did well in the Dutch roasters championship this year.
As for the comments on a scientific approach ...well, we can't all be sitting round with a refractometer taking measurements, though I would agree to controlling variables where possible.

One thing I'd like to add is that coffee farming is hard, manual labour, and the farmers don't really make much money. Direct trade, which has been one of the better developments to arise from the new wave of smaller roasteries, is making some pretty big waves towards changing this. By cutting out the middleman the farmers can work with the roasters to find the most desirable qualities, allowing them a higher price per kg.

D'ya drink at Lot 61? One of Takk Manchesters barristas has just moved out to work there. Photos make it look worth a visit.

We've just got one of those Sage coffee machines for work. They've loaded it with some darkly roasted starbucks beans, but coffee comes out ok. Much better than those pod things, but it's nowhere near a properly good espresso. Heston doesn't agree though.

I bought an Aeropress yesterday. Consequently, today I’ve smashed straight through “morning pick-me-up” into “racing pulse, can’t think straight” territory. Lovely stuff.

Up till now I've been using a cafetiere but find I get quite a lot of sediment, which I don't always like. Decided to get a basic plastic filter cone thingy to try.

Any tips on how to get the best from it? So far I've tried pouring the water in slowly as it trickles through, and I've tried passing the coffee through a second time to try make it stronger... Inspired by the kopi tarik technique used in malaysia where they " pull " the coffee through the grounds several times to achieve a rich coffee....

http://www.urbancoffee.co.uk/2012/04/brewing-recipe-v60/

@TM
My 2p (Disclaimer: I am no scientist, but I know a bit about coffee and have used all of the main methods discussed here)
The only way to get the coffee to pour slower would be grind finer - but a coarse grind produces better flavour etc with a filter. I would definitely avoid passing it through the grounds more than once as you'll just end up with bitter coffee. Pour over filters tend to produce coffee that is nearer to tea in viscosity and is quite a different drink as the paper filters the oils which you get in espresso or cafetieres.
If you want a richer/ more espresso like coffee and don't want to stump up for a home espresso machine then you're better off using a stovetop. Aeropress is a good middle ground, as it allows a longer brew process before you press the coffee through the filter - so you can have espresso-like coffee with clear, distinct flavours, but without the oils and bitter flavours you can get with stove tops and home espresso machines if you aren't careful with cleaning and temperatures etc.

If you are using pre-ground coffee, it would be worth investing in a cheap-ish grinder (you don't need an expensive one if you're only grinding for filter) with some ability to vary the grind, and experiment with it.

Also - more #rep for @big_daddy_wayne

Classic coffee response "buy more stuff"

You still appear to be struggling to get off your high horse. Need a hand?

i think some of you have been drinking too much coffee
would some kind of taste off be a good way to settle this argument ? kind of like the walk off in zoolander but with less puckering ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8720XS-pquc

Can't we all be friends?

@Lukemdfree - it's worth bearing in mind that this is a bike forum (and a niche one at that), you're unlikely to meet many experts here. If you want to really geek out, there are dedicated coffee forums elsewhere.

Any love for the percolator here? My kenwood's been banging out some lovely consistent brews recently. Or is percolator old hat?

Thanks @Sumo and @dan very useful. I have a grinder but an old school manual one, however mrs TM has just started working in accounts at Taylor's/Betty's so I'll ask her if they can grind me some filter coffee in their staff shop. The walk through on that link is really good Henry, lots of pointers I wouldn't have thought of.

@Alkali percolator is same as stove top as just mentioned by dan , I'm considering getting one but are they not a bit of a faff?

Wait this is like when @EdwardZ ruined the Leather shoes thread.

By what? Upset that leather Chucks are not considered "proper leather shoes"?

They key with filter is getting the weights of the coffee and water right.

@TM I was in Wales all last week and ran out of the Climpson's I had brought with me. I ended up drinking Taylor's (the green one - Afternoon somethingorother) most of the week, which turned out to be the best pre-ground 'OTP' supermarket coffee I've ever had. No fireworks, but produced decent coffee via aeropress and cafetiere.

+1