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• #5902
I used translate page but it scobled it. are they saying they do or do not incur blame for not wearing a helmet now?
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• #5903
BGH-Urteil zu Unfallschäden: Radfahrer haben auch ohne Helm vollen Anspruch auf Schadensersatz
Good to hear that. Ciq, the judgement found in favour of a woman who had had her compensation for a dooring reduced by 20% by a lower court. (The Bundesgerichtshof is one of Germany's five supreme courts. It deals with civil and criminal law.)
It's risky, though, to base the judgement partly on helmet-wearing rates:
**Der BGH hob dieses Urteil nun auf und sprach der Radfahrerin vollen Schadensersatz zu. Das Tragen eines Schutzhelms sei für Radfahrer schließlich nicht vorgeschrieben. **Auch habe es im Unfalljahr 2011 nicht dem "allgemeinen Verkehrsbewusstsein" entsprochen, dass ein Fahrradhelm "zum eigenen Schutz erforderlich und zumutbar gewesen wäre". 2011 hätten innerorts nur elf Prozent der Radfahrer einen Helm getragen.
For those without German--the first (bold) bit is fine, as it merely states that there's no duty to wear a helmet while cycling. The second bit, though, states that in 2011 it hadn't been part of 'general traffic awareness' that a helmet would have been 'required for one's own protection and reasonable' ("zumutbar"--untranslatable but literally means something like 'appropriate or possible to be imposed'). It then cites the stat that in 2011 only 11% of riders had worn helmets in towns or villages in Germany. There's an implication that this 'general traffic awareness' might have changed in the meantime. -
• #5904
It's not the law, so, it is up to the individual..
All I can say is helmets will not make you invincible. They can't and won't protect you against every kind of damage. But I've had at least one crash in my life that wasn't my fault, had nothing to do with my skill as a rider, and if I hadn't worn a helmet would have cracked my skull open (head at speed onto the sharp, cornered edging of a deep concrete ditch.). As it was most of the helmet stayed wedged around the concrete edging.
A skilled and attentive rider will always be safer than an unskilled or foolish one, but sooner or later there will come a time when all your skill doesn't save you from the unexpected, or simple bad luck. A helmet can't guarantee your safety, but your chances with it once that happens are better than without it.
If anyone else watches 24 Hours in A&E, the staff on there have commented several times that from their own experience treating downed riders, that helmets really do make a difference.
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• #5905
glad to hear you're ok. the problem is when the promotion of helmet and hi viz are prioritised by those in authority as a legitimate way of promoting road safety when they should clearly be promoting enforcement and the provision of usable infrastructure.
the perception:
https://twitter.com/safer_roads/status/478545975913771008
the reality:
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• #5906
Why are those who hate helmet less riders not anti classic cars?
Mother fuckers driving around with no air bags and they didn't even test for an NCAP rating let alone score 5*.
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• #5907
http://uk.mobile.reuters.com/article/idUKKBN0ES28120140617?irpc=932
15% of cyclists wear them in Germany . Worrying that many more seem to be wearing them here.
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• #5908
when they should clearly be promoting enforcement and the provision of usable infrastructure
Agreed, on both. Cyclists need to be aware of the rules of the road, and how to ride safely (don't ride alongside HGV's and buses for a start); safe routes, and lights for night-time cycling should be a legal requirement.
High vis is good, simply because I've seen for myself the difference it can make in spotting a cyclist from a vehicle, but it can't be the whole solution.
Motorists need educating in also obeying the rules of the road, especially those relating to cyclists - awareness, respecting cycle lanes/stop areas, safe driving, and the fact we have a legal right to use the roads.
The police need to land on both groups when they break the laws.
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• #5909
(don't ride alongside HGV's and buses for a start)
why not? in case you haven't noticed, HGVs and buses share road space with cycles, if it is as unsafe as you suggest for bikes to be in the vicinity of them, then surely the fault lies with the operators and designers of these vehicles. more often than not, it is these sorts of vehicles that pull up alongside cyclists who are already stationary. Also, much of the existing infrastructure funnels cyclists into this contentious position on the road - ASLs.
safe routes
i'm not sure what you mean by this.
lights for night-time cycling should be a legal requirement.
they are.
The police need to land on both groups when they break the laws.
nope. see operation 'safeway'
other than that, you're on the money :)
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• #5910
why not?
I may have worded this badly - large vehicles, especially HGV's, have massive blind spots for cyclists. you have to ride alongside them sometimes, but things like riding in close, stopping alongside them at junctions, undertaking buses, etc. It's not purely the cyclist's job, but understanding and minimising hazards is a part of staying alive on city roads on a bike, esp. as a cyclist will nearly always come off worse than a motorised monster.
i'm not sure what you mean by this.
Safer cycling infrastructure - cycle lanes, safe junctions, etc. In fairness London has been getting slightly better in this department. Your comment about motor traffic being funneled in with cyclists is an example.
they are.
Cool, didn't know that. With the number of night-time cyclists with no lights on, I'd assumed it was only recommended, like helmets.
nope. see operation 'safeway'
Actually, that is eactly the sort of thing I'm in favour of :). Dangerous motorists will almost always be the bigger danger, but neither group should get a free pass on behaving like a prat. Or just being irresponsible.
other than that, you're on the money :)
eh, 0/4 isn't bad, right? ;) -
• #5911
like you i'm all for more enforcement for all road users, however seeing every junction rammed with plod dishing out poor / entirely erroneous advice to people on bikes, a few days after 6 cyclists were killed in as many days, doesn't inspire much confidence in their priorities. Enforcement is just a byword for victim blaming in such cases.
The greater issue is really how cycle (and pedestrian) related incidents are treated with disdain by the CPS.
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• #5912
^and by the judges in passing some very lenient (in my opinion) sentences if these matters do get to court.
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• #5913
yup. pretty sure we're all preaching to the choir here.
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• #5914
http://uk.mobile.reuters.com/article/idUKKBN0ES28120140617?irpc=932
15% of cyclists wear them in Germany . Worrying that many more seem to be wearing them here.
Helmet propaganda has been relentless in Germany for years.
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• #5915
Helmet propaganda has been relentless in Germany for years.
trufax
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• #5916
Helmut propaganda has been relentless in Germany for years.
trufax
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• #5918
Race??
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• #5919
Yes race
1 deer
2 people injuredhe races, crashes into a deer, tells everyone to wear a helmet for "just cycling down the road"
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• #5920
Not noticed any deer on my commute (other than in the butcher's window) but advice is noted.
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• #5921
From the comment section.
I CYCLE TO WORK PAST DEER AND I NEVER WEAR A HELMET. THE DEER ARE HANGING UP IN BOROUGH MARKET.
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• #5922
I banged my head on one of these in a pub once
I was standing on a table. Foolishly helmetless
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• #5923
Staggering.
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• #5924
They can strike at any time, best to be safe
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2oymHHyV1M
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• #5925
I banged my head on one of these in a pub once
I was standing on a table. Foolishly helmetless
Staggering.
Oh deer.
BGH-Urteil zu Unfallschäden: Radfahrer haben auch ohne Helm vollen Anspruch auf Schadensersatz